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Master Pocketwatch Thread

Started by Metal Head, April 23, 2007, 04:19:08 AM

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dman762000

Yes,yes, yes, this information would possibly help in my quest to repair my 1898 elgin, or my 1895 gruen, please sir do publish your knowledge.
"Dammit all, the hydrogen catalysts have gone off again!"

Per Ardua Surgo

HAC

Of those 2, the harder to repair, may be the Gruen, as parts for those are a bit less common. What ails the Elgin?

Cheers
Harold
You never know what lonesome is , 'til you get to herdin' cows.

Sir Theodore Catchpole

 thanks very much for going this i look forward to it

Marcus Bell Of Ulm

Oh yes. I have wanted to get into watchcraft for some time. Lookin' forward to it.
Nothing is foolproof to the sufficiently talented fool.

Major Francis Cleverly

Thank you sir for your contribution!

I posted about my pocketwatch (Elgin dated 1909) and have been interested in obtaining others recently.  I found two that I am interested in, both Elgin (I have interests in that particular manufacturer) one silver cased from 1897 and another from 1915, I'd love to peruse anything you can come up with, watches of this vintage fascinate me and I'd love to read more about them.

Thanks again!
Nothing.

HAC

Thanks for the support, all...
The "A Steampunk's Field Guide to Pocket Watches" has been started...

Cheers
Harold
You never know what lonesome is , 'til you get to herdin' cows.

Drake White

Just found this and I must say I REALLY want it.


http://www.boomertime.com/5%20Pocket/P3025/P3025.htm

Anyone wanna lend me a few quid? ;)

Major Francis Cleverly

Quote from: Drake White on July 30, 2007, 06:03:54 PM
Just found this and I must say I REALLY want it.

THAT is a beautiful watch.  Great find!
Nothing.

rogue_designer

Quote from: oskila on July 28, 2007, 01:15:36 PM
Hmmz...

I found a small imprint on the inside of the back cover and a similar one on a part of the movement (could be what wikipedia says is a bar. I don't even know what these parts are called in Swedish...). The imprint, or engraving or whatever :) reads GF or possibly CF and is framed by an oval shape. Could this be some sort of manufacturer's signature or similar?

Probably GF - gold filled.
Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam.
(Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes. But deserve a nice glass of absinthe. I have some Montemarte in the cabinet, if you wish.)

HAC

#59
Quote from: Drake White on July 30, 2007, 06:03:54 PM
Just found this and I must say I REALLY want it.


http://www.boomertime.com/5%20Pocket/P3025/P3025.htm

Anyone wanna lend me a few quid? ;)

Its not railroad approved. The "Overland" came in two models, one was hunter cased, the second (as pictured) open face. You can tell the movement was designed for a hunter case, as the winding stem is at the "15:00" position (also known as a "sidewinder"). This is the later stem wound version, the huntercased one was a keywind.  It COULD perhaps be described as railroad grade,as it meets one or two of the required specs ,  but it would never be railroad approved.  Current 2007 price guide suggests it should be worth $400US in MINT condition..
AND the original "Overland"  movements were NOT skeletonized, but were full plate movements, looking more like this:



Still, it IS quite the attractive watch. Personally, I'd lose the spade hands and oput on something a bit more in keeping with the style..
Cheers
Harold
You never know what lonesome is , 'til you get to herdin' cows.

anjin

Well, I can just say thay if you need help for a professional "design" for the pdf I am here available. :)
--
Anjin
"un marinaio non prega per il tempo buono... impara
a navigare"
www.anjinart.com
http://anjinart.blogspot.com

HAC

Appreciate the offer... Might juts take you up on it  :)
Cheers
Harold
You never know what lonesome is , 'til you get to herdin' cows.

oskila

Quote from: rogue_designer on July 30, 2007, 06:16:00 PM
Probably GF - gold filled.

I see. Cheers!

Now, what does that mean?  :)
Whoever after due and proper warning shall be heard to utter the abominable word "Frisco", which has no linguistic or other warrant, shall be deemed guilty of a High Misdemeanor, and shall pay into the Imperial Treasury as penalty the sum of twenty-five dollars. (Emperor Norton I of the US, 1872)

S.Sprocket

Combined both pocketwatch threads to avoid confusion and made it sticky so people will add to this rather than make their own pocket watch thread, enjoy reading!
"It's what a cove knows that counts, ain't it Sybil?  More than land or money, more than birth.  Information. Very flash." -Mick Radley

"Teaching boys to bake cakes? That's no way to maintain an industrial empire." --Fred Dibnah

rogue_designer

Quote from: oskila on July 30, 2007, 07:45:21 PM
Now, what does that mean?  :)

Borrowed from another forum:

Gold-plating refers to a chemically or electrically bonded thin layer of gold that is usually 5 microns to 40 microns thick. Many times, items are plated simply on the outside, and not both sides of the metal.

Gold-filled, on the other hand, refers to a much thicker layer of gold 80 microns or thicker (depending on the number of years stamped) that is mechanically bonded to the core metal (usually brass). The core sheet is sandwiched between a sheet of gold on each side and then run through a press under high pressure many times until the sheets have bonded and are of the proper thickness.

Gold filled cases contain much more gold than gold-plated cases, wear much longer than gold-plated cases and have gold bonded to both sides of the metal.

Your stamp isn't one of the standard ones, so we don't know how many years/thick the gold is, but I can't think what else the GF might mean on a watch case.
Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam.
(Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes. But deserve a nice glass of absinthe. I have some Montemarte in the cabinet, if you wish.)

HAC

To legally qualify for the gold filled stamp in Canada the weight of the gold layers had to be at least 1/20th of the total weight of the metal in the sandwich of gold and base metals. The patent for "gold filled" metal was granted to J.Boss in 1859
As an aside, you often see Americal watch cases stamped in "years" ie 10 years, 20 years, 25 years. That was a sign of the thikcness of the gold layer. The case was warranted by the manufacturer to not wear through to the brass, in that many years (in normal use).
In 1924, the US government ruled that practice illegal, leading to a swith in labelling to 10K or 14K gold filled, as applicable.
I have a couple pages of diagrams that show the variuos case grade and maker marks, those will be in my guide, as well as case types, and how top properly handle a hunter watch case (hint- NEVER snap it shut)

Cheers
Harold
You never know what lonesome is , 'til you get to herdin' cows.

Sir Theodore Catchpole

Quote from: Drake White on July 30, 2007, 06:03:54 PM
Just found this and I must say I REALLY want it.


http://www.boomertime.com/5%20Pocket/P3025/P3025.htm

Anyone wanna lend me a few quid? ;)

oh god do i want that!!!!!!!!!

Major Francis Cleverly

I just picked up another watch.  No pictures yet - likely tomorrow.  But it's a very different one from the other one I picked up last week.  This new one appears to be of a more modern (1930's?) type, the brand appears to be Ingraham.

On the inside it says: The E. Ingraham Company Bristol, Conn, USA 51

The front says: Biltmore Radium

In the sunken part where the seconds are it says: Ingraham

Anyone have any information on it?  The Radium thing was kind of intriguing, I'll have to research it a little more.  Appears to keep nice time...
Nothing.

Kabuki

Aahh, yes...  Nuclear Pocket watches! Never need winding, but they DO require a Lead, Osmium, or Iridium lined case.
The only thing more important that squashing one's foe, is doing so with style and panache... - Jake of All Trades


Join the fun here: http://www.b

rogue_designer

#69
Quote from: Major Francis Cleverly on July 31, 2007, 11:18:03 PM
The front says: Biltmore Radium

The radium refers to radioactive paint, used to make parts luminous. It contained the luminous phosphor zinc sulfide (ZnS) and a laquer binder, with a bit of a radium salt such as radium bromide or sulfate.

Heads up btw... if you open up the case. The paint is even more dangerous now than when fresh, since it has often lost its integrity and formed flakes which can be breathed into the lungs. Nobody wants radioactive particles stuck in the lungs.
Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam.
(Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes. But deserve a nice glass of absinthe. I have some Montemarte in the cabinet, if you wish.)

HAC

Quote from: Major Francis Cleverly on July 31, 2007, 11:18:03 PM
I just picked up another watch.  No pictures yet - likely tomorrow.  But it's a very different one from the other one I picked up last week.  This new one appears to be of a more modern (1930's?) type, the brand appears to be Ingraham.

On the inside it says: The E. Ingraham Company Bristol, Conn, USA 51

The front says: Biltmore Radium

In the sunken part where the seconds are it says: Ingraham

Anyone have any information on it?  The Radium thing was kind of intriguing, I'll have to research it a little more.  Appears to keep nice time...

Ingraham purchased Bannantyne Watch Company in 1912. They made what were known as 'Dollar Watches" with a full plate, unjeweled Roslkopf type lever movement. The "Biltmore" was one of those, two models, one of whoch had a luminous dial , the 'Biltmore Radium".. Radium dust off old watches is to be avoided, as it can be a real health concern, not just from any residual radioactivity, but also its toxicity. Ingrham went out of business in 1968.
Hard to actually date your watch, as there are no Ingraham serial numbers..

Cheers
Harold
Harold
You never know what lonesome is , 'til you get to herdin' cows.

Major Francis Cleverly

Quote from: rogue_designer on August 01, 2007, 07:19:04 PM
Heads up btw... if you open up the case. The paint is even more dangerous now than when fresh, since it has often lost its integrity and formed flakes which can be breathed into the lungs. Nobody wants radioactive particles stuck in the lungs.


Oh, THAT was that odd smell/taste.  ::) I did open the case, but wore a papermask as I figured the "Radium" on the inside meant something bad.....  I'd read a little about the radium girls of the past and well, radium is a bad thing, so I figured better safer than sorry.  It seems like a pretty cheap watch - it was only $20 or so at the local antique shop.  I thought it would be an interesting conversation piece if nothing else... I did manage to get some photos:


Front - Don't worry, I wore a paper mask and closed the lid very quickly.


Back - Harold - is that what a "full plate" means?


Sorry about the crazy perspective - lights wouldn't cooperate today.  This is just to show the inscription.
Nothing.

HAC

#72
According to the 2007 price guide thats probably worth about $40.00, in that condition.
As I said, its definitely a Roskopf type movement, no jewels, pressed balance wheel, etc.
Ingraham made these for the working class trade. The watches were good enough timkeepeers
(probably to a minute a day or so, perhaps better), were cheap, and fairly reliable...
Nice find, and a nice bit of history..
Cheers
Harold
You never know what lonesome is , 'til you get to herdin' cows.

Kabuki

Quote from: HAC on August 01, 2007, 08:08:54 PM
According to the 2007 price guide thats probably worth about $40.00, in that condition.
As I said, its definitely a Roskopf type movement, no jewels, pressed balance wheel, etc.
Ingraham made these for the working class trade. The watches were good enough timekeepeers
(probably to a minute a day or so, perhaps better), were cheap, and fairly reliable...
Nice find, and a nice bit of history..
Cheers
Harold

Looks rather similar to the Westclox Dollar watches, such as my Bullseye and Scotty.
The only thing more important that squashing one's foe, is doing so with style and panache... - Jake of All Trades


Join the fun here: http://www.b

Anachronist

#74
I found a lovely Waltham at the antique store last month, and just received it back from my horologist after a thorough cleaning and adjustment. The face needs cleaning (though honestly, I like the way it looks, so it probably won't receive it), but the movement is, according to him, "untouched". I'm pleased with my find.







The movement says about as much as I know about it from research: 19 jewel, "Riverside" grade, 1890's - 1910's.

Awful pretty, though.

Regards,
Alexander
The first sign of the beginning of understanding is a wish to die.