Victorian food brands still extant

greensteam · April 01, 2012, 10:33:24 PM

Quote from: yereverluvinunclebert on April 01, 2012, 04:53:41 PM
@greensteam - Not eaten stilton, you must be a cheese virgin! To have not eaten stilton is not to have lived. If I had to name only one, it is probably the single most important prerequisite food for a steampunk Englishman.

In that case I am that rare animal: the predead zombie. I adore virtually all cheeses except stilton, the smell of which is too offputting. Odd really as I love many other strongly but differently smelling cheeses.

There are other criteria that I don't meet: I am not a man and although born in england, I am of welsh/french background and have lived longer in Scotland than anywhere, so of your defining characteristics I can really only comply with the steampunk!

J. Wilhelm · April 01, 2012, 11:16:55 PM

True enough Ms. Greensteam. And following previus comments I agree than some American Cheddars can be very good. It's the effect of marketing and the association that people outside of America have, combined with the raw power of mass market capitalism.

Other foods and cuisines have suffered greatly through this phenomenon of mass marketing. Namely, most types of Mexican Food found internationally, and which tend to be the stereotypical Atom-Age version of Tex-Mex marketed in the US, as opposed to the real thing, which didn't really undergo a Renaissance until the 2000's.

J. Wilhelm · April 02, 2012, 12:03:26 AM

Quote from: Dr. Madd on April 01, 2012, 09:05:46 PM
Altoids- Founded in the 1700's.

Thank you for noting that Mr. Madd: Originally introduced by Smith Kendon in 1780 so the Altoids should be added to the UK list I think (UK is their country of origin, but noting they were more successful in the US after 1918, and production moved by owner Wrigley to the US - Chattanooga Tennessee, but I have no other dates to back it up)

The updated American list (separate list for Canadian Brand/Foods)

Spoiler: Show

von Corax · April 02, 2012, 01:02:01 AM

Uncle Bert, I shall be honoured to maintain a list on behalf of the Dominion.

Stilton is most assuredly available in Canada (or at least in Southwestern Ontario), both from specialty cheese merchants and from the national grocery distributors' upscale chains (Loblaw's, Metro, Sobey's). Greensteam, living in the UK and not having tasted Stilton is like living in Canada and not having tasted maple syrup.

Darkhound, I understand Maytag Blue is rather good, although I have never seen it to try it.

yereverluvinunclebert · April 02, 2012, 02:56:47 AM

When the lists are done, we can compare and see who eats the best. I intend to eat mine, not the list, the things on the list. I'll go shopping and get the lot in one go.

@greensteam - apologies, by Englishman, I meant the race of, the species, not merely the male half. As we all know the female is the superior side of man. Do you agree gents?

Stilton has the unpleasant smell of old foot but that should not put you off. Buy a small round of non-chalky, preferably non-pasteurised Stilton, do not refrigerate, serve room temperature. Make a sizable hole in the top and pour in good vintage port so it seeps into the stilton. Serve by scraping the stilton/port mix using tea spoons onto Carrs water biscuits.
The port might disguise the smell, tastes utterly divine.

yereverluvinunclebert · April 02, 2012, 02:58:06 AM

Altoids make the list as do nigroids, are they in the US? I doubt it, the politically incorrect sweet.

yereverluvinunclebert · April 02, 2012, 03:04:41 AM

I had not heard the processed yellow slices called "American Cheese" here in the UK. It is certainly a negative term that has been lost over time. The only time that sort of processed cheese is seen here is when buying a bad burger such as those from McDs. I avoid these like the plague and always insist on a proper burger, crusty bread and real cheddar every time. No slices please.

J. Wilhelm · April 02, 2012, 04:54:57 AM

Quote from: yereverluvinunclebert on April 02, 2012, 02:58:06 AM
Altoids make the list as do nigroids, are they in the US? I doubt it, the politically incorrect sweet.

Most definitely they are. http://www.wrigley.com/global/brands/altoids.aspx Extremely popular and ubiquitous in America since 1918; the place of manufacture was moved from Bridgend, Wales by parent company Wrigley to Chattanooga Tennessee as they sold more in America. I have included them in the list, but a bit of a violation as the Altoids were not introduced into the US during Victorian times.

Quote from: yereverluvinunclebert on April 02, 2012, 03:04:41 AM
I had not heard the processed yellow slices called "American Cheese" here in the UK. ... The only time that sort of processed cheese is seen here is when buying a bad burger such as those from McDs...

Yes that is a bad burger.... And let me state for the record that many Americans are baffled at the international success of McD. Certainly you can find better choices.

J. Wilhelm · April 02, 2012, 06:17:07 AM

Well blow me down! I should have known better! I have neglected the American love for meats and steak sauces... plenty of history here folks. Again the presence of the UK in America is NOT to be neglected:

A1 Steak Sauce (developed by 1824 by Henderson William Brand, a chef to King George IV, marketed by Brand &Co. 1831, and then bought and brought to the US by G.F. Heublein & Brothers. 1895, not in Canada until 1931)

Arm and Hammer Baking Soda (Not a food but an ingredient, Another industry giant. 1867 James A. Church; the Arm and Hammer logo represents Vulcan, the Roman god of fire and metalworking)

Barnum Animal Crackers ("Animal Biscuits" developed in Victorian times in the UK and introduced into America by Nabisco 1902- Not quite Victorian but at the "edge" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Barnum%27s_animals_examples.JPG)

The two American giant coffee makers and "nemesis of one another":

Maxwell House Coffee (1892,Tarrytown, New York named in honor of the Maxwell House Hotel in Nashville)

Folger's Coffee (The Folger Coffee Company was founded in San Francisco, California, 1850 http://www.folgers.com/about-us/folgers-history.aspx)

Morton Salt (again not a food but an ingredient. Supergiant. The discovery of gold in California in 1849 created a huge demand for salt as fortune-seekers made the long journey west. Originally created in 1848 as "Richmond & Company," Joy Morton -whose father served as secretary of agriculture - acquired a major interest in the company in 1889 and renamed it the Joy Morton & Company. Chicago)

Keebler's cookies(biscuits) and crackers (A giant domestic baked goods company. Godfrey Keebler Bakery founded in 1853, Philadelphia Pennsylvania. The Elves (mascots) are not Victorian though)

Hershey's Chocolate / The Hershey Food, Co. (International chocolatier giant. Founded by Milton Snavely Hershey first as a candy shop in Philadelphia, which failed within six years. After trying unsuccessfully to manufacture candy in New York, Hershey returned to Lancaster Pennsylvania, where he founded the Lancaster Caramel Company, 1894).

Philadelphia Cream Cheese (a type of Petit Suisse, and also comparable in taste, texture, and production methods to Boursin and Mascarpone. First made by William Lawrence in 1872. Founded 1880, Philadelphia Pennsylvania)

Welch's grape juice and jelly / Welch Foods Inc. (1869, Vineland, New Jersey by Thomas Bramwell Welch who invented the method used to pausteurize grape juice to halt fermentation into wine)

And many many more from this list (http://www.recipelink.com/companies.html) which I will continue tomorrow, when I have more time, or if someone would be kind enough to go through this list correlating to Wiki entries, and weeding out those companies which did not start in Victorian times!

Cheers,
J. Wilhelm

yereverluvinunclebert · April 02, 2012, 10:25:18 AM

It sounds like you are going to be eating better than me. He said grumpily.

yereverluvinunclebert · April 02, 2012, 10:44:41 AM

The A1 sauce is a strange one, disappeared from the UK shelves in the 1980s and I never quite got to taste it... It is still made and no doubt will come back to our shelves at sometime. If it was still here then I would add it to the UK list I think.

Angus A Fitziron · April 02, 2012, 12:30:48 PM

Jacksons of Piccadilly purveyor of tea! Began in 1815, and still extant, though I don't know for how much longer - think they are owned by Tetley...

yereverluvinunclebert · April 02, 2012, 02:42:07 PM

Tea seems to be like the alcoholic beverages, a lot of choice

J. Wilhelm · April 03, 2012, 12:17:27 AM

Quote from: yereverluvinunclebert on April 02, 2012, 10:25:18 AM
It sounds like you are going to be eating better than me. He said grumpily.

I don't know... It's all in the execution. But I am a little shocked to see that if I define "Victorian Food" as name brands, then I AM already eating Victorian food every day of the week! Hate them or not these food conglomerates got their start solidly in the 19th. C. And we are not even talking about grocery companies (many of which were 'trading posts' in the developing West of the US), which will be interesting to see...

I should also pair General Mills (parent company) with Pillsbury, a subsiduary:

General Mills, (Baking ingedients/ baked goods /canned goods super-giant, Minneapolis, Minnesota,1866 by Cadwallader C. Washburn who bought and expanded the 1856 Minneapolis Milling Company)

Mott's apple sauce (f. 1842 by Samuel R. Mott in Bouckville, New York, as apple cider and vinegar producer)

Oooooh! I hit the jackpot! This is my staple food due to my persistent lack of coinage, which demands I make pots of rice and sausage every week; Alright gentlemen, I don't have to be so ashamed that my list "looked too modern" and lacked "indigenous food," This one makes up for the entire American list, adding Cajun/Creole/French flair to the list, and also adds the possibility of Root Beer to the list of Victorian brands (if we can find a Vic. Root Beer brand still extant):

Zatarain's ( a New Orleans style-condiment and food company, now part of McCormick. Originally a root beer company, founded by Emile A. Zatarain, Sr., 1889, New Orleans, Louisiana)
Examples of seasonings: Crab and Shrimp Boils, Creole Mustard, FishFry (Basically seasoned corn flour). Jambalaya, Dirty Rice, Red Beans and Rice, and Black Beans and Rice. In the 20th C. and 21st. C. available as instant rice packages or ready to eat packages.

Which reminds me I have to go to buy food right now! $6 for 5 days of dinner (yes I'm that poor). Me landlady hates me when I cook past 9:00 PM. I'll make Jambalaya tonight for the next 5 days... Here's the updated American list while I go to the supermarket...

Spoiler: Show

J. Wilhelm · April 03, 2012, 03:09:43 AM

I'm back and wondering if we should have another list for mainland European brands. There are many of importance present in the Americas

Knorr, a dehydrated soup and condiment company (1838 by Carl Heinrich Theodor Knorr, Germany)

Somehere in this thread I had already mentioned

Maggi sauce / Maggi Wurze (1872/1890 Julius Maggi, Switzerland)

Perhaps I could recruit the abilities of Herr Shoggotho for the European list?

Miss Calendula Malmesbury · April 03, 2012, 10:51:05 AM

Hovis bread?

yereverluvinunclebert · April 03, 2012, 10:59:20 AM

Thank you Miss Calendula, we have Hovis on the list as we do Warburtons. So we have some dietary staples. We welcome all suggestions.

J. Wilhelm · April 04, 2012, 06:40:25 AM

...And it just keeps coming. Always ridiculously ubiquitous names and products.

In the UK list, have you included Tunnock's Teacakes?

Tunnock's / Tunnock's Chocolate Teacakes (Thomas Tunnock, 1890, Uddingston, Scotland)

For the American list, I was walking through my local "HEB" supermarket yesterday when I got more names (an interesting story H. E. Butt Grocery, itself if we made a grocer's list). HEB tailor their product line to the neighborhood, which in this case happens to be an international college-oriented neighborhood and also happens to have a Jewish demographic. I couldn't miss the mountains of Kosher products for Passover (this local HEB has a Kosher deli inside), and among the product brands was this one:

B. Manischewitz Company, LLC (Kosher foods, by Rabbi Dov Behr Manischewitz, 1888 in Cincinnati, Ohio)

Obviously non Kosher:

Armour fresh pork and canned goods/ Armour and Co. (originally a slaughterhouse and meat packing company, Philip Danforth Armour, Chicago, Illinois, 1867)

in other aisles:

Smucker's pancake syrup/ J. M. Smucker Company (Maker of fruit-based syrups, marmalades, preserves and jellies, 1897,by Jerome Monroe Smucker, Orrville, Ohio)

also for the US list
NECCO / New England Confectionary Company (Maker of a type of "sugar wafer" candy, 1901, Revere Massachusetts), At the edge of the Victorian period, it was created by the merger of 3 Victorian companies (1847,1848,1856). Their claim to fame is their contribution to soldiers food rations during WWI

Walk by the baking-supply section, and I notice we have forgotten a very important company for all three lists, and quite present in the US / UK / Europe / Latin America:

Nestlé S.A. (supergiant international confectioner and chocolatier among many other foods, Henri Nestlé, Vevey, Switzerland, 1866). Because this is the product of the 1905 merger of baby-food companies, the Swiss Farine Lactée Henri Nestlé and the American-owned/British-established Anglo-Swiss Condensed Milk Company, then Nestlé S.A. should be included in the American and UK lists as well as the European list...after 1905 the company was operating factories in the United States, United Kingdom, Germany, and Spain. Latin America thereafter.

Also in the baking supply section:

Fleischmann's yeast (Charles Louis Fleischmann, his brother Maximilian, and James Gaff in Riverside, Ohio, in 1868)

French's / French's Mustard (Condiment Co. Founded by Robert Timothy French, 1883 Fairport, New York/1884 Rochester New York as the R T French Co.)

I know that Worcestershire sauce is included in the UK list, but should Lea & Perrins Worcestershire sauce be also be included in the US list? Being so present in America since the 19th. C. (The American version is bottled in a dark bottle wrapped in paper, according to the US branch, to follow traditional manner in which imported bottles were shipped to the US in the 19th.C.).

And should we include Perrier in the UK list? And the US? I'm assuming it came to America in the 20th. C. but the company was bought by Sir Saint-John Harmsworth in the 19th C. I believe... I know it was marketed mostly in the UK presumably still during the 19th C., but I ignore if Sir Saint-John Harmsworth also marketed in the US before the turn of the century.

Perrier mineral water (Louis Perrier, Vergèze, France, 1898)

For the European List:

Evian mineral water (in 1859 the business became a public company as the "Société anonyme des eaux minérales de Cachat, Savoy - then annexed to France) It may not be added to the UK/US lists because it was not sold in the UK or US until 1908.

Angus A Fitziron · April 04, 2012, 08:16:10 AM

Tunnock's Tea Cakes! How could we have missed that, the veritable food of the cogs...

Spoiler: Show

Camellia Wingnut · April 04, 2012, 08:27:05 AM

Ladies and Gentlemen,
I applaud your revival of the foods of my youth, (before I had Ahmad in the bazaar make my wooden teeth). Here they are: Wincarnis, a vile meat wine for invalids. Ribena Blackcurrant cordial. Jujubes for the throat, used by singers in private musical evenings - also excellently shaped for stopping the ears of the audience.
Cheerio

bicyclebuilder · April 04, 2012, 08:27:47 AM

It seems that Victorian liquids "preserve" better than solids.

Lot's of beers and spirits, a few drinks and an occasional cookie or byproduct. (with a few exceptions)
If you're planning on making a store/restaurant with genuine Victorian products, I'd suggest to make dishes and pastry from that period. Only products would limit your inventory.

Camellia Wingnut · April 04, 2012, 08:32:11 AM

Oh, yes. Where are my wits? Eno's fruit salts pioneered peculiar philosophy in the papers (Sorry, got stuck on 'p' alliterations. My governess would rap my knuckles). Alas, Chlorodyne - the all-purpose laudanum-laced syrup, which dear Rudyard chugged while writing "The Phantom Rickshaw". . . And Frye's Turkish Delight, bland but naughtily evocative of harems.

Camellia Wingnut · April 04, 2012, 08:35:31 AM

Chlorodyne, I meant to say, is no longer available except in outre Steampunk nightclubs.
And quote an Eno's ad: "Oh, Why Should the Spirit of Mortal be Proud?" and endless verses of the same.
Pip Pip!

J. Wilhelm · April 04, 2012, 09:14:26 AM

Quote from: Camellia Wingnut on April 04, 2012, 08:27:05 AM
Ladies and Gentlemen,
I applaud your revival of the foods of my youth, (before I had Ahmad in the bazaar make my wooden teeth). Here they are: Wincarnis, a vile meat wine for invalids. Ribena Blackcurrant cordial. Jujubes for the throat, used by singers in private musical evenings - also excellently shaped for stopping the ears of the audience.
Cheerio

Thank you for your contribution Lady Wingnut;

Unfortunately Ribena only goes back to 1936, hence non-Victorian.

Jujubes on the other hand do go back and should be on the American list. Originally developed by the Heide confectionary company (1869) which was bought by Hershey's (1995) and finally sold to Farley's & Sathers Candy Co., Inc (2002).

so for the American list:
Heide maker of Jujubes / Jujyfruits (Henry Heide, New York, 1869)

For the UK list:
Wincarnis (a type of meat extract plus wine tonic, no longer contains meat (!) f. 1881[2] by Coleman and Co Ltd in Norwich, England now made by Broadland Wineries in Norfolk, and sold by Macleod.

J. Wilhelm · April 04, 2012, 09:25:43 AM

Quote from: Camellia Wingnut on April 04, 2012, 08:32:11 AM
Oh, yes. Where are my wits? Eno's fruit salts pioneered peculiar philosophy in the papers (Sorry, got stuck on 'p' alliterations. My governess would rap my knuckles). Alas, Chlorodyne - the all-purpose laudanum-laced syrup, which dear Rudyard chugged while writing "The Phantom Rickshaw". . . And Frye's Turkish Delight, bland but naughtily evocative of harems.

Eno Fruit Salts:

QuoteThe fast-acting effervescent fruit salts, used as an antacid and reliever of bloatedness, was invented in the 1850s by James Crossley Eno

-Wikipedia

Yes, Victorian and extant presently, but not a food! Perhaps as part of a list of remedies for a heavy meal or if not a list of digestives. Altoids would be on that list as well as that was the original purpose of the curiously strong mint!

Chlorodyne: Not extant, I'm afraid as tincture of cannabis is a controlled substance under most American States' laws, and perhaps our British friends can illuminate us on the subject on that side of the Atlantic. Alas, not an extant product, regardless of legal status.

Fry's Turkish Delight: Only goes back to 1914. I'm terribly sorry... Close but no cigar.

I remain truly yours,

The Most Hon. Marquis SantaCruz;
Adm. J. Wilhelm,
United States Airship Command

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Victorian food brands still extant