Victorian food brands still extant

[Mercury Wells]

https://taiken.co/single/the-origin-and-history-of-japanese-curry-rice

Possibly due to my browser set up, the above address is now a "forbbiden 403" (why does the spelling of "forbbiden" look wrong to me.  )

I get 403 as well. (And it's "Forbidden.")

Ok I can't spell. 

[J. Wilhelm]

UK/Empire:-

Franklin & Sons (soft drinks) Ltd. Est 1886

US list:-

Watkins Extracts & Essences Est 1868

Wow. I hadn't read the whole history of the Watkins company (sorry for the delay in analysis - shows you how crazy life's been this year).

I must say three things:

First, it's no wonder I'd never heard of this brand. This is one of those unusual companies that for most of it's life was marketed by door to door salesmen. It's always been a niche company. The fact that it's survived over a century and a half speaks to the cunning nature of its leadership.

Second, this company is even more unusual in that it actually recovered from a strong downturn in the 1970s. Most companies which couldn't survive the rise of supermarkets either changed their business model completely, got sold, or closed doors. Instead, Watkins continued to sell door to door and actually grew back to health in the 1980s, which is even more surprising given the historical period. Watkins did however enter the supermarkets, but more as a specialty and gourmet brand more likely to be found in health and nature centered supermarkets. They've expanded their product line to include barbecue marinades and spirits as well.

Third, this company is even more unusual in that they've preserved a lot of history. They're very proud of their history, and thus their timeline is full of facts and photos. It's going to take me a while to compile all of that, but for the moment Watkins Products makes into the listing. Expect this entry to be modified in the near future.

Watkins, spices and gourmet foods (Founded as s medical liniment company by JR Watkins, Plainview Minnesota, 1868)


I'm going to have to swing by Whole Foods,or Albertsons to see if I can spot a bottle as those are the only two local shops listed as carrying their products. Albertsons is a regular supermarket, but Whole Foods is the top health/nature centric supermarket in the US. Surprisingly Whole Foods started business right here in Austin, and only recently changed hands to Amazon, which have done their best to destroy the company, apparently, by cheapening their products.

[J. Wilhelm]

US list:-

Horlicks (Malted Milk Drink) est. 1873

(I was going to add "Ovaltine", but that was est. 1904)

Reviewing the Horlicks brand, oddly enough Ovaltine would be a better choice for the US and Horlicks would be for the UK and Commonwealth. The 1904 date is close enough for consideration of Ovaltine, if it comes down to a few months of industrial activities.

The reason for excluding the brand from the US is that I can't find any products with the brand today. Their timeline at Wikipedia suggests the US side of the company was purchased by the British side in 1945, and thereafter the brand is not mentioned in the US; instead, in the 1970s, factories were established in India. If I can find some shops that sell the imported product maybe it could go back to the US list.


~~~ I can't find any history of Horlicks on their website ~~~~~~


This is s company that was started by British expats in the US, but then the brand was exported to the UK and then manufactured in the UK before the end of the Victorian Era.

Sometimes companies can't survive in their country of origin, but they survive in the export markets and emigrate. In the UK we've already talked about A1 Steak Sauce, which survives in the US.

There are a few notable American companies that come to mind who suffered that fate: Woolworth's department stores which survive in Mexico and Lawson's convenience shops which are now famous in Japan. Another very famous one, but which finally disappeared altogether after the pandemic was none other than Radio Shack, with surviving shops in Mexico City until 2020 (!).

[yereverluvinunclebert]

Geo. Watkins Mushroom Sauce is to die for.

[J. Wilhelm]

Geo. Watkins Mushroom Sauce is to die for.

Different Watkins, I'm afraid. I listed JR Watkins from Minnesota, 1868. You just mentioned George Watkins' Mushroom Ketchup, I believe, which gets it's start from a Quaker grocer family of the same name in London, 1830.  Unless you've listed Geo Watkins sauce in this thread before, I believe you just found another brand for the Empire!

Geo. Watkins is a brand owned at the moment by AB Foods, a Polish company. But if the brand and product were continuously sold in the UK, regardless of ownership, I believe that's a legitimate name to be added.

https://geowatkins.com/

~~~ And again, no history on their website~~
Modern transnational companies from mainland Europe don't care much about history, do they? Is it some sort of liability regulation, such as against false advertising?

[J. Wilhelm]

Not Victorian, but I found this interesting infographic on the oldest companies still extant in Europe. A good number of them are breweries. Some are food related companies.

[Mercury Wells]

I found this a while ago:-

https://i.imgur.com/lzGOs7K.png (oldest businesses in the US)

[J. Wilhelm]

I found this a while ago:-

https://i.imgur.com/lzGOs7K.png (oldest businesses in the US)

Worth taking a look. I spotted at least one brand already on the list (Texas: Imperial Sugar).

As an anecdote, El Farol Restaurant in Santa Fe New Mexico (1835), called my attention.
The restaurant offers dinner with dancing shows for entertainment.

[rant]
In spite of it's age, however, the food type served and dancing shows are troubling. The restaurant bills itself as a Tapas Bar. They feature dances from the National Flamenco Institute. Why is that a problem? Because it's a long standing mid 20th C stereotype in the US. Mexicans don't dance Flamenco. Tapas are strictly Spanish and I believe a 20th Century phenomenon. Flamenco is strictly a cultural heritage from the region of Andalusia in Spain.

It's doubtful that the frontier Mexican region of New Mexico (During 1830s prior to the Mex-Am War, 1848), which was still evangelizing Native Americans would feature such shows and food for regional festivities. But Americans have long associated the Flamenco on Mexican portrayals dating to the 1950s (eg Looney Tunes cartoon portrayals of Mexico).  Bull fighting is Spanish also, but at least the practice is commonplace in Mexico, while Flamenco is not.
[/rant]

[von Corax]

Getting a little off-topic here, but a few days ago the oldest company in Canada (the Hudson's Bay Company) celebrated its 352^nd anniversary.

[J. Wilhelm]

Getting a little off-topic here, but a few days ago the oldest company in Canada (the Hudson's Bay Company) celebrated its 352^nd anniversary.

1670. That's quite respectable. The coat of arms couldn't possibly be more Canadian:

Heraldic achievement of Hudson's Bay Company: Argent, a cross gules between four beavers passant proper. Crest: On a chapeau gules turned up ermine a fox sejant proper. Supporters: Two bucks proper. Motto: (Latin) pro pelle cutem, lit. 'skin for leather.

[von Corax]

Getting a little off-topic here, but a few days ago the oldest company in Canada (the Hudson's Bay Company) celebrated its 352^nd anniversary.

1670. That's quite respectable. The coat of arms couldn't possibly be more Canadian:

Heraldic achievement of Hudson's Bay Company: Argent, a cross gules between four beavers passant proper. Crest: On a chapeau gules turned up ermine a fox sejant proper. Supporters: Two bucks proper. Motto: (Latin) pro pelle cutem, lit. 'skin for leather.

[Sorontar]

If I didn't know they were beavers, I would say they looked like four flatcaps.

Sorontar

[von Corax]

If I didn't know they were beavers, I would say they looked like four flatcaps.

Sorontar

Beavers do look like flatcaps in real life.

[Mercury Wells]

Oldest Sodas in the World.

[J. Wilhelm]

Oldest Sodas in the World.

Yep. All of them are on the list, plus the one from Ecuador. They did not mention Mexico's Mundet, which is on the list, however. There's at least one American brand they didn't mention (Dr Brown's)

[Mercury Wells]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

[J. Wilhelm]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

They're webpage is prompting me to chat with a representative.   . Shall we tell the latest sausage jokes?

[yereverluvinunclebert]

Hmmm, the thread continues under SMF 2.0.19!

[Mercury Wells]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

They're webpage is prompting me to chat with a representative.   . Shall we tell the latest sausage jokes?

Will you be comfortable with a long or short one?. 

[von Corax]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

They're webpage is prompting me to chat with a representative.   . Shall we tell the latest sausage jokes?

Will you be comfortable with a long or short one?. 

These jokes are the wurst...

[J. Wilhelm]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

They're webpage is prompting me to chat with a representative.   . Shall we tell the latest sausage jokes?

Will you be comfortable with a long or short one?. 

These jokes are the wurst...

Frankly, you should never see how they're made, and much less how they're stuffed.

[Mercury Wells]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

They're webpage is prompting me to chat with a representative.   . Shall we tell the latest sausage jokes?

Will you be comfortable with a long or short one?. 

These jokes are the wurst...

Frankly, you should never see how they're made, and much less how they're stuffed.

I quite enjoy getting stuffed with a sossie or two. 

[J. Wilhelm]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

They're webpage is prompting me to chat with a representative.   . Shall we tell the latest sausage jokes?

Will you be comfortable with a long or short one?. 

These jokes are the wurst...

Frankly, you should never see how they're made, and much less how they're stuffed.

I quite enjoy getting stuffed with a sossie or two. 

Two??!? *Shocked* Holy, St. Andouille!

[Mercury Wells]

US List:-

Habbersett Meats 1863.

They're webpage is prompting me to chat with a representative.   . Shall we tell the latest sausage jokes?

Will you be comfortable with a long or short one?. 

These jokes are the wurst...

Frankly, you should never see how they're made, and much less how they're stuffed.

I quite enjoy getting stuffed with a sossie or two. 

Two??!? *Shocked* Holy, St. Andouille!

Anyway do Habbersett Meats go into the US list?

[J. Wilhelm]

Well, yes it appears to be all OK. Started squarely in the mid 19th century, continued production, and even tied to local ethnic food. They started as a meat processing company and are famous for a type of meat loaf known as Scrapple or Panhaas among the Pennsylvanian Dutch.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habbersett