The Queer Geer Mk. II: A club for the LGBQT+ crowd and friends

[J. Wilhelm]

I think Zero is an amazing addition to steam powered giraffe

And why is that, specifically?

[J. Wilhelm]

A properly antiqued photo (right click to enlarge)

[Mme. Ratchet]

If you'll recall, I was quite upset with the change a few months ago, but after seeing him perform, I changed my mind

[Aubreay Fallowfield]

I agree, I enjoyed the new addition

[J. Wilhelm]

GAH!  I'm sick of the rubbish passed as shoes coming from China. I just found massive cracks and tears on the rubber sides of my 3rd pair of winter boots. They're 1 1/2 months old!! The other two pair lasted about 3 months each. Sadly, these doubled as a component of my Steampunk Luftschiffengel outfit. And I liked them because being "duck boots" they look like rubber boots with leather spats or gaiters on them.

I guess it's back to the drawing board. The issue with rubber boots is that they don't have the ability to flex too many times before the rubber hardens and cracks. Wherever there is a crease on the material as you walk, after a few hundred cycles cracks begin to appear in the rubber surface. The best I can do is "patch" and close the cracks with cyanoacrylate glue, but almost immediately, other cracks begin to appear next to the repairs.

Its probably because of the poor quality of the vulcanized rubber.

This week I'll purchase a pair of all-suede industrial work boot I found, which by no means have the charisma of the duck boots, but hopefully will last longer. The price is the same...

I'm so pissed off about it

[J. Wilhelm]

As I watch the good news coming from France today, a faint glimmer of hope in an environment where otherwise the Western world has largely descended to xenophobic insanity and talibanesque homophobia - under the pretext of preserving morals, I stumbled on an important message.

Written by the mother of a trans child in the State of Texas where I live - from the very surprising point of view of someone who has had a recent change of heart after seeing her own daughter suffer at her own hands from a belief system she adhered to, and from her peers as well. They say the love of a mother knows no bounds. This is the proof.

Please note the surprising website where this was posted (an unlikely source of support for trans people), but also note the negative reaction from her peers. This is what we are facing this Spring in the state where I live. The proposed anti-trans law has been approved by the Texas Senate and will now go through the House of Representatives (lower house), before becoming official law.

http://www.texasgopvote.com/family/texas-conservative-christian-mother-speaks-out-against-sb6-bathroom-bill-009665

The proposed law (with annotated analysis), soon to be official law if it is passed through the lower house
https://apps.texastribune.org/texas-bathroom-bill-annotated/

JW

______________________________________________________

Liberté, égalité, fraternité!

[J. Wilhelm]

THE MOST AWESOME TROLL. EVER.

I won't elaborate on politics here. Makes me proud to live in Austin.   I just couldn't resist posting the photo. You can look the names for yourself and find out why this is awesome.

EVIL IS NEVER SMART.

JW

[Mme. Ratchet]

So I've been doing some thinking on my steampunk costume and am trying to decide on a pair of shoes and a skirt for one that is meant to be a military service dress outfit. Since the coat that it goes with is red (as in a British redcoat), I'm thinking there should be some red in the skirt, but I don't know the first thing about Victorian skirts. Any thoughts?

[J. Wilhelm]

So I've been doing some thinking on my steampunk costume and am trying to decide on a pair of shoes and a skirt for one that is meant to be a military service dress outfit. Since the coat that it goes with is red (as in a British redcoat), I'm thinking there should be some red in the skirt, but I don't know the first thing about Victorian skirts. Any thoughts?

At this point, you have to start breaking history timelines. There are no precedents for long elaborate skirts in a combat or field role in the 19th. C, so you basically need to start exercising your Steampunk brain muscles and come up with an anachronistic back story to justify the existence of skirts in a military setting.

The obvious anachronism to apply is the role that women had in WWII, and perhaps even before that. At some point, women had to start wearing trousers and shorter more modern skirts to be able to serve in an office and on the field. The roaring 1920s helped a lot by eliminating the length of a skirt, and introducing trousers. In modern times we don't think about these things because women go all over the place either wearing short, pencil, or Chanel length skirts to the office all the time, or trousers to combat and we don't bat an eye about it. But a bustle skirt would hardly be appropriate for any kind of military service on account of practicality, never mind morals.

Look at real examples, and the look at historical pictures, both in the 19th. and 20th. C. You goal is to adapt a modern 20th. C skirt and make it look like a 19th. C. one in terms of styling but not length and function.

I can't tell you what that is, because that depends more on your back story, and to be frank and honest if you look at pictures on the web, the idea of skirts for most young Steampunbk girls on the net is "sexy hot tramp" rather than either a practical or historical looking one.

I do suggest posting on Anatomical, so the girls in the forum can help you think about this process. They have a lot more ideas than I do.

BTW, I've already exported my costume out of Queer Geer into the larger community - that is to say, my costume has already "come out of the closet" if you pardon the pun, and quite literally. 

Post in Anatomical and start thinking about your character!

JW

[Mme. Ratchet]

I'm already breaking history timelines, that's not the issue, and of course there isnt a precedent for an elaborate skirt in a field role, that's not what service dress is for. Service dress is for special occasions where you are wearing a dress uniform, like at a ball, award ceremony, or formal dinner. A woman at the time in the military, were they allowed to be in the military in the first place, would be *expected* to wear an elaborate skirt, so the simple existence of being a female military officer would validate the existence of a skirt somewhere in the uniform lineup.

A bustle skirt, or more likely a formal skirt in general, would absolutely be appropriate for military service in a formal setting, and even until fairly recently women in the US military were authorized to wear dress trousers or a knee length dress skirt in their dress uniform.

I'm not interested in "sexy hot tramp" skirts, which is why I haven't been looking at many of those skirts. I'm interested in "classy, formal dress for an officer", where practicality is not much of an issue and neither is historical appearance.

I am not ready for this aspect of the character to quite hit the larger forum yet, which is why I'm asking here in a more casual sense. So you'll have to excuse me for that, gods forbid I ask a casual question, lest I be grilled over why my decision is wrong. -_- This is why I don't come around very often.

[J. Wilhelm]

I'm already breaking history timelines, that's not the issue, and of course there isnt a precedent for an elaborate skirt in a field role, that's not what service dress is for. Service dress is for special occasions where you are wearing a dress uniform, like at a ball, award ceremony, or formal dinner. A woman at the time in the military, were they allowed to be in the military in the first place, would be *expected* to wear an elaborate skirt, so the simple existence of being a female military officer would validate the existence of a skirt somewhere in the uniform lineup.

A bustle skirt, or more likely a formal skirt in general, would absolutely be appropriate for military service in a formal setting, and even until fairly recently women in the US military were authorized to wear dress trousers or a knee length dress skirt in their dress uniform.

I'm not interested in "sexy hot tramp" skirts, which is why I haven't been looking at many of those skirts. I'm interested in "classy, formal dress for an officer", where practicality is not much of an issue and neither is historical appearance.

I am not ready for this aspect of the character to quite hit the larger forum yet, which is why I'm asking here in a more casual sense. So you'll have to excuse me for that, gods forbid I ask a casual question, lest I be grilled over why my decision is wrong. -_- This is why I don't come around very often.

Alright then. So you've already started defining your story by calling this a Service Dress uniform. Are you being specific in your terminology (i.e. Full Dress uniform)?

I don't think anyone here is going to "grill you" over why a decision is wrong (I don't think everyone agrees with my Elven Lederhosen US Army uniform), and I am willing to bet my lunch money that most people here know less about military uniforms than you do, including yours truly. And if you can survive me, you can survive most people in the forum. I have one of the most "intense" personalities here... (enough to repeal a few trolls and problem users we've had in the past), so me thinks you are in friendly territory.

So we know this is not a fatigue type of attire, nor a field service uniform. Strictly ceremonial. And you say this is a British uniform? You said red. Rank?

[Mme. Ratchet]

I said service dress in the first place... Yes, I'm referring to, more or less, a full dress uniform. Yes, it is a British uniform but it doesn't fall neatly in to one specific branch. The story I'm working with is that she works in a military capacity in service of the Crown, but is not directly answerable to any one military command, but rather is an agent of the Crown. So "rank" doesn't really apply, per se, which I am utilizing to take ultimate creative license with the entirety of the uniform.

[Cora Courcelle]

You can't go wrong with adding braid and buttons so why not make them red to tie in with your jacket?
If you go for the bustle then there's plenty of edge to attach braid to both at the back and the front if you choose an 'apron' type bustle; if you settle on something with more of a 'Gibson Girl' silhouette then there's loads of scope for sewing on braid in any variety of patterns, perhaps inspired by military frogging. Add buttons at the top of a seamline near the waist to simulate fastenings, perhaps even put the same buttons on the jacket to really bring the two together.  A lot of sewing I'm afraid but ooooh this sounds as if it could be fun! 

[Miranda.T]

Hmm.. I think I'd go for something with really sharp lines, as the military like that sort of thing. Not too fussy either - elegant but efficient, you might say. So, I have in my mind's eye the skirt as floor length and quite slim fitting (esentially fin de siècle style), with the extravagance coming in the bustle; something intricately folded and layered but with a strong geometric structure. In terms of rank, what about using the edge trimmings to delineate that? I'd imagine different colours and styles, with maybe a basic black lace for a lowly sergeant or whatever up to expensive (or at least expensive looking) gold braid for the upper echelons. Maybe some detail in the bustle too could show this - only the equivalent of Admirals or Field Marshals are allowed to accent with diamonds, with the aforementioned sergeant stuck with opal or garnet.

Yours,
Miranda.

P.S. Hi Cora - I think we are thinking along broady similar lines  .

[J. Wilhelm]

I should point out that while there is no 19th C precedent for long skirts in the field /fatigue or service uniform (American military sense of the word),there is precedent for ceremonial military dress.

In this picture below, the two eldest daughters of Tsar Nicholas II, are wearing full dress military uniforms.

Perhaps this is a good reference?

JW


EDIT:

If this was not a red full dress uniform, but another colour of British uniform, I'd sat say the British Grenadiers' uniform would be awesome:

Givenchy cropped jacket $3500

Russian Emperor Nicholas II, wearing a British Grenadier Guards' Frock Coat, during a celebration for Queen Victoria,
on the occasion of the achievement of the longest reign in British history, Balmoral, September 1896
(right-click to zoom in)

JW


PS

For embellishments on long skirts, perhaps a good idea is to look at folkloric female attire. The dress is a female version of the "charro" musician's suit, which itself is an elegant embellished variation of late 19th C Central Mexican rancher's attire

Mexican Crossover Folkloric/Western/Pop Singer Lucero.

[Mme. Ratchet]

You can't go wrong with adding braid and buttons so why not make them red to tie in with your jacket?
If you go for the bustle then there's plenty of edge to attach braid to both at the back and the front if you choose an 'apron' type bustle; if you settle on something with more of a 'Gibson Girl' silhouette then there's loads of scope for sewing on braid in any variety of patterns, perhaps inspired by military frogging. Add buttons at the top of a seamline near the waist to simulate fastenings, perhaps even put the same buttons on the jacket to really bring the two together.  A lot of sewing I'm afraid but ooooh this sounds as if it could be fun! 

Cora, I'm not sure that the "gibson girl" look is quite entirely what I'm looking for, though it certainly does look similar to the skirts worn by Tsar Nicholas II's daughters in the picture that J. Wilhelm shared. I do quite like the looks of some of these apron type bustles, though. Especially the ones which are more modest and trim in the back, or if they had a fan bustle.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/13/9b/b5/139bb535522143b7e8db9e0e34d07569.jpg

Something like this is pretty nice. I'm not sure what you guys think, though. Lot's of ways that I could embellish this, too.

Hmm.. I think I'd go for something with really sharp lines, as the military like that sort of thing. Not too fussy either - elegant but efficient, you might say. So, I have in my mind's eye the skirt as floor length and quite slim fitting (esentially fin de siècle style), with the extravagance coming in the bustle; something intricately folded and layered but with a strong geometric structure. In terms of rank, what about using the edge trimmings to delineate that? I'd imagine different colours and styles, with maybe a basic black lace for a lowly sergeant or whatever up to expensive (or at least expensive looking) gold braid for the upper echelons. Maybe some detail in the bustle too could show this - only the equivalent of Admirals or Field Marshals are allowed to accent with diamonds, with the aforementioned sergeant stuck with opal or garnet.

Yours,
Miranda.

P.S. Hi Cora - I think we are thinking along broady similar lines  .

Miranda what do you think of the above skirt I found? It's a simply victorian pattern, and is quite extravagant while being modest at the same time (modest as in not too over the top). As far as rank goes, since I don't have an official rank it will be difficult to denote anything, so there's that.

[Cora Courcelle]

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/13/9b/b5/139bb535522143b7e8db9e0e34d07569.jpg

Something like this is pretty nice. I'm not sure what you guys think, though. Lot's of ways that I could embellish this, too.

That does look very nice; just a word of caution if you decide to make it and do the draping on a dummy rather than from cut pattern pieces:  Remember you have to get it off the dummy and onto you (which may seem obvious when written here but in the excitement of getting just the right fold/train/frill is, unfortunately, very easy to forget.  Trust me on this!)

[Mme. Ratchet]

I don't own a dressmaker's form, so I don't have to worry too much about that! It would just be made from pattern pieces and put together.

[Miranda.T]

(snip)

Miranda what do you think of the above skirt I found? It's a simply victorian pattern, and is quite extravagant while being modest at the same time (modest as in not too over the top). As far as rank goes, since I don't have an official rank it will be difficult to denote anything, so there's that.

That is absolutely lovely  Elegant but not extreme; very appropriate for the scenario. In terms of rank, rather than something specific some 'high end' adornment might say to an onlooker "This person is pretty damn important and you'd better give her a snappy salute pronto!"

As to the 'dress form', it might be possible to knock something up as it's just from the waist down; even something as simple as foam or pillows held together by belts to give roughly the right shape propped on top of a stool might help the process of draping. We have a cheap mannequin which is just supposed to be for show or draping a few clothes on; it's something ridiculous like a size (UK) 6, but I take some old baby-grows from when the children were small, wrap them around it and then hold them in place by strapping on one of my corsets. By lacing it up by the same amount as I do on myself it produces quite a decent approximation of my shape (which needs an extra digit added before the '6' of the mannequin...)

I should point out that while there is no 19th C precedent for long skirts in the field /fatigue or service uniform (American military sense of the word),there is precedent for ceremonial military dress.

In this picture below, the two eldest daughters of Tsar Nicholas II, are wearing full dress military uniforms.

Perhaps this is a good reference?

JW


EDIT:

If this was not a red full dress uniform, but another colour of British uniform, I'd sat say the British Grenadiers' uniform would be awesome:

Givenchy cropped jacket $3500

Russian Emperor Nicholas II, wearing a British Grenadier Guards' Frock Coat, during a celebration for Queen Victoria,
on the occasion of the achievement of the longest reign in British history, Balmoral, September 1896
(right-click to zoom in)

JW


PS

For embellishments on long skirts, perhaps a good idea is to look at folkloric female attire. The dress is a female version of the "charro" musician's suit, which itself is an elegant embellished variation of late 19th C Central Mexican rancher's attire

Mexican Crossover Folkloric/Western/Pop Singer Lucero.

My dear Admiral Wilhelm - I swear you must hold a black-belt fifth dan in the art of internet searches 

Yours,
Miranda.

[Mme. Ratchet]

(snip)

Miranda what do you think of the above skirt I found? It's a simply victorian pattern, and is quite extravagant while being modest at the same time (modest as in not too over the top). As far as rank goes, since I don't have an official rank it will be difficult to denote anything, so there's that.

That is absolutely lovely  Elegant but not extreme; very appropriate for the scenario. In terms of rank, rather than something specific some 'high end' adornment might say to an onlooker "This person is pretty damn important and you'd better give her a snappy salute pronto!"

As to the 'dress form', it might be possible to knock something up as it's just from the waist down; even something as simple as foam or pillows held together by belts to give roughly the right shape propped on top of a stool might help the process of draping. We have a cheap mannequin which is just supposed to be for show or draping a few clothes on; it's something ridiculous like a size (UK) 6, but I take some old baby-grows from when the children were small, wrap them around it and then hold them in place by strapping on one of my corsets. By lacing it up by the same amount as I do on myself it produces quite a decent approximation of my shape (which needs an extra digit added before the '6' of the mannequin...)

I should point out that while there is no 19th C precedent for long skirts in the field /fatigue or service uniform (American military sense of the word),there is precedent for ceremonial military dress.

In this picture below, the two eldest daughters of Tsar Nicholas II, are wearing full dress military uniforms.

Perhaps this is a good reference?

JW


EDIT:

If this was not a red full dress uniform, but another colour of British uniform, I'd sat say the British Grenadiers' uniform would be awesome:

Givenchy cropped jacket $3500

Russian Emperor Nicholas II, wearing a British Grenadier Guards' Frock Coat, during a celebration for Queen Victoria,
on the occasion of the achievement of the longest reign in British history, Balmoral, September 1896
(right-click to zoom in)

JW


PS

For embellishments on long skirts, perhaps a good idea is to look at folkloric female attire. The dress is a female version of the "charro" musician's suit, which itself is an elegant embellished variation of late 19th C Central Mexican rancher's attire

Mexican Crossover Folkloric/Western/Pop Singer Lucero.

My dear Admiral Wilhelm - I swear you must hold a black-belt fifth dan in the art of internet searches 

Yours,
Miranda.

Yeah, Admiral Wilhelm is magical.

That size struggle is real, sometimes. I'm in a US 18, myself, and it can be pretty tough.

[J. Wilhelm]

My dear Admiral Wilhelm - I swear you must hold a black-belt fifth dan in the art of internet searches

Thank you Miranda. You flatter me, but the devil knows more because he's old, rather than because he's the devil.

I saw the Tsar's daughters pictures elsewhere in this forum a couple of years ago so I knew what to google online. And most junior highschool kids used to have a huge crush on Lucero when she was a pop teenage idol in Mexico City in the early 1980s. She switched from pop to folkloric/western and grew up into a gorgeous woman.

JW

[Mme. Ratchet]

I like that. The devil knows more because he's old, not because he's the devil.

[J. Wilhelm]

I like that. The devil knows more because he's old, not because he's the devil.

It's an old Mexican expression. As I'm usually older than any one around me, I find that the expression fits.

[J. Wilhelm]

As the enemy encroaches upon us, as they lay their traps, as they draw our blood, we stand united to resist. As they smear our names and rob our dignity, we shall fight to quell their lies and let the truth be known. No more will we let their lies rule our lives. No more will we live in darkness. And we will shine a light as bright as the Sun on those who hide the the truth.  We will train our wings and take flight up in the heavens, all around the globe. We were not born to hide in a cave. We were born to sing praise to God, fight and defeat evil.

- Icarus Guilder's Mantra

Today, by way of Twitter decree, there are people who can't serve their country because of who they are. Some of them will not be allowed to enter service and worse, those who are and have been serving will be discharged.

To make matters more interesting, the executive (not to be confused with the judicial) branch in charge of enforcement of laws, the Department of Justice, has released a white paper stating that protection against discrimination for being LGBQT is NOT a part of something called Title VII of the Civil Rights Acts of 1964 - Meaning that you can be protected by federal law when someone discriminates you due to race, color, religion, sex, or national origin, BUT the act does NOT cover discrimination for being gay or transgender.  

I don't think the simultaneous release of the presidential Twitter decree and the white paper by the DoJ is a coincidence. This is a well timed preparation for a major policy change in the executive branch of the United States.

While Title VII was never explicitly written to protect people from gender / sexual orientation based discrimination, it does mean that past policies -based on Title VII - which favoured protecting LGBQT people in court cases will no longer be followed when federal agencies (e.g. FBI) are prosecuting criminals. In other words, the Justice Department and other agencies will no longer seek to punish those who injure you in any capacity simply because you are LGBQT. Crimes against an LGBQT person will still be prosecuted, but not based on allegations of discrimination as described by Title VII.

Such a cavalier interpretation of the law is a full declaration of war against the LGBQT community and will now surely pit the Judicial power against the Executive power of the United States in matters of LGBQT rights. Only the Judicial branch of the United States can protect your rights as an LGBQT person by way of a court veredict on a case by case basis. In other words, this places LGBQT people in the same category as racial minorities were prior to 1964, when there was open and legal discrimination in various aspects of society, in some States within the United States where racial segregation was legal. I guess if you are LGBQT, now is the time to decide whether you want to live in Texas or California.

Back on the subject of the military, I'm not sure an Honorable Discharge will feel so honorable to those who are being let go. The word Loyalty simply doesn't have the same weight it used to have, it seems.  We can pray for better days to come, but I don't think that just asking God for help from above is enough, when you can do something yourself.

Those of you who can, try to see of you can lend a hand to any LGBQT people affected, or be of moral support to those military service members affected by these discriminatory policies. Even if it's just working by shining a light on the truth. Now is the time to see whether your prior position in society was correct or misguided, and let your heart place your allegiance on the side of truth.

Thank you for listening to my rant

JW


PS Oh. The irony:

[Mme. Ratchet]

Admiral Wilhelm, you can now see exactly why I do not ask for help in Anatomical. Because this bullshit happens every time I ask for help outside of here.

Not to mention, I came to the forum today fleeing all the nonsense on Facebook about the tweet. I didn't expect to be bombarded with it here, too. How lovely. Can't be safe anywhere.